New Christie large venue

[donaldk]

Beast is right, did Christie manage to integrate the laser rack?

[Art Sonneborn]

Who is going to be first to have it in their home ?


Art

[w.mayer]

I will consider it.

The question will be simple.
Are the only advantage this pr. have (infinty cr.) over my existing Barco Thor make sense to upgrade?

On the pro side it is “only” the infinty cr. on off.
On the con side is much more:
-likely an insane high price
-no sealed light engine
-less good 3D system compare to 6P laser 3D
-and as you can see this pr. is a huge monster. So this means I need to cut my last row in my cinema and
build there a new huge Pr. room that can handle this huge and noisy pr.

So it will be a good question if I am willing to do this all just to improve my on off cr. from today "OK" to "supergood" and deal with all
the negative points.

Also a big question is for me will it be wise to spend this likely insane money and dealing with the above stated issues knowing LED walls are the better picture when reflections visible gabs between the panels and panel visibility itself is solved?

This all have to be included it to the decision.

[Art Sonneborn]

I will consider it.

The question will be simple.
Are the only advantage this pr. have (infinty cr.) over my existing Barco Thor make sense to upgrade?

On the pro side it is “only” the infinty cr. on off.
On the con side is much more:
-likely an insane high price
-no sealed light engine
-less good 3D system compare to 6P laser 3D
-and as you can see this pr. is a huge monster. So this means I need to cut my last row in my cinema and
build there a new huge Pr. room that can handle this huge and noisy pr.

So it will be a good question if I am willing to do this all just to improve my on off cr. from today "OK" to "supergood" and deal with all
the negative points.

Also a big question is for me will it be wise to spend this likely insane money and dealing with the above stated issues knowing LED walls are the better picture when reflections visible gabs between the panels and panel visibility itself is solved?

This all have to be included it to the decision.

<\q>


Summed up well. As I've said, I personally believe that we are quite near the end of projection thus anyone who invests in it at this point must consider the very real possibility that the device could be obsolete very quickly. Although I believe that this is the best there is, spending this much could result in some of the biggest buyers remorse on record.


Art

[w.mayer]

Art

I do not agree with you that you say " we are quit near the end of projectors".

At this time there is not any kind of new development that will reduce the price from this LED Walls at least no one I know today.
So it can be that it will take 10 years before we see a significant price drop or it can be even longer or it can be
faster.
All this is today pure speculation.
If someone know this today he can stop working and buy shares from this company!
So forget it now one knows for sure.

Don’t forget that you see some disadvantages from LED Walls.
I have seen the Sony 1 year ago and I complain about visible panels gabs and reflections.
Seeing the Samsung LED Wall in a cinema some weeks ago I can’t see any of this bugs at least not from where I sit.
LED Walls react very different when you sit to the side!
The more you sit on side the more you see all this!
Than the worse audio.
My new screen is from top to bottom left to right full with a only 0,5” masking means my picture is the full maximum size I can do.
Visible bigger that what you saw as screen is now not only bigger it is also more close to the viewers.
With a LED wall I have to shrink it as I need to go behind the wall and even more the speakers will have a very wrong position and will for sure decrease on top the size of the picture.
The sound will be much worse for sure.
Also near black LED Walls have their problems.
They show pure black but the near blacks are not have a good color fidelity.

That’s all why I say the Christie can be an option for me.
But until there is nothing official about price and delivery it is at this time only speculation.

And how knows may I will stay with my "ok cr. Barco Thor" I have for much longer.

The Technical Director from the biggest Cinema in Germany visit me some days ago.
Reason was that he like to see my new V6 screen.
He was so impressed that he say.
“I wish that cinemas can offer some day such a good picture and sound quality to the public”
I ask him how he like Dolby Vision and he say to me that in real word in cinema DV just looks a bit better in on off cr. but all other parameters of the picture my setup with the Barco Thor is on pair or likely superior.
I take this as a huge compliment but knowing and telling him that the port hole glass the DV need kills a lot of the picture quality.
In my private cinema I do not need port hole glasses and Exit signs that ruin the infinity cr. the Christie  Pr. had.

And last our age is something to consider.
Do you really like to wait that our eyes get so weak that a new Projector or LED Wall makes not any sense anymore.
So waiting is may good when you are younger but we both have our age right?

[w.mayer]

Just watched with the whole family Star Wars in 3D in the only Dolby Cinema in Germany in Munich.

We all not like this movie and I was surprised how bad the movie itself was.

Image quality was also not really good but the worst was that there were hardly any parts where you could see real black!
Everything was in gray even all space sequences and the opening sequence and not show a good black that the Dolby Vision Trailer show before the movie itself.

Imagine someone spends over 300.000$ for a Christie Eclipse Projector or a micro LED Wall that can do perfect black and the source you play do not have any 100% black material on!!!
What a shame!!!
This is really a nightmare and I wonder really how Dolby can let this happen!

Also I can detect for the first time a minor miss convergence that I had not seen before.
Then on top of this all in some bright sequences I see vertical lines on the screen but as other sequences not show it the screen can not
be the reason why it was visible.
May it is some kind of interferences that are caused by the special light engine?

[MrPixels]

This does not surprise me. Star Wars has a large cult following, it is as if the writers and producers know they do not have to put any effort into the film quality its followers will show up regardless. To me the series lost its wow factor several movies ago. The picture quality took on a very flat look, lacking contrast and color. Almost looks like it is being shot with a cheap camcorder.
Hard to believe they booked a Dolby cinema for this. You are one of the few who are knowledgeable and care about picture quality, sadly most viewers probably did not notice. Add to this you paid extra money wanting to treat your entire family to a special movie experience.


Surprised to hear about the visible misconvergence. You would think the techs would have caught this but this is a complicated system, it is possible this is a common issue.

[w.mayer]

Why Dolby Vision accept such a picture quality from Disney at such a big movie?

I drive more than 100km with my family payed a big premium to see Star Wars in a “Dolby Vision” Theater.
The only one in Germany.
Then they show me there how perfect black can be in a “Dolby Vision Theater” with their trailer and 5 min. later the movie starts and all the good black is all gone because the source itself have not any real black sequence inside!
It is a huge difference when you select a normally cinema where black is not black because the limitation of their projection system.
But with a Dolby Vision Cinema you expect black as they promote it.

Convergence was a very minor issue hard to see.
Missing black or better no real black at all was beside the lines and some overall so la la picture quality a big disappointment.

I respect Dolby and I know that they care about picture quality but again I not understand at all how they accept such a bad looking Source Material from Disney.
At the end the normal consumer will not complain about Disney they will say “ I saw Dolby Vision” and it not looks much better than a normally Cinema.
Every good double Projector setup in other Cinemas will look as good as the Dolby Cinema with this source material.

The average Joe that not care about picture quality at all is not the typically “Dolby Vision” customer.

But even worse as no one will see a real black with this movie no matter how much money you spend for your display system at home thanks to Disney wrong made Source!

[Art Sonneborn]

Sad but obviously Dolby Cinema has no control of this any more than they do of Disney truncating the bass in their films. At least with the bass , EQ can be employed to bring it back up but no fix for encodes with no black.


Art

[Peter CINERAMAX]

After living with the barco 15k series 4 laser, these beasts are super efficient, the 9,000 lumen eclipse should be enough for 90% of home installations.


One should take great care of not overexposing to the potent light these projectors send out of the porthole. It is better to use an optical screen like the reald and get the gain at the screen where it is harmless and get all the extra sharpness, and color saturation benefits that a screen that redirects light to the audience manifests.


Even with throwing out a lot of light with contrast mods to the lens, the 15 k lumen is way too bright, i ordered a schneider projection panavision aspect 45ND filter, 64% light drop 1.5 stops. Will report.


The idea is keep the light coming out of the porthole at semi-benign levels, and get a beautiful sharp and high mtf HDR Image through the best engineered screen. Trust me I get zapped by that light almost daily, TOO STRONG. So 9,000 lumen should be more than enough in an expertly laid out visual environment.


The nanoperf ultimate screen acts like the torus, i have compared the torus with the barco, and 11 scope v6 with 6p and the DUO Plus at Brads with 13.5 wide 1.77.All within 24 hours  Because of the larger size and consumer level projector SIM2+v6 is a good match  so was the thorhc at cinemacon when we tested the v6 (perfect for the thor6p top level balanced saturation, the small sdr rgb laser christie was not a good match at cinemacon 16 for the v6.


Nothing however sucks you into the image like the torus, and pretty sure the Ul Screen for 3p laser. In 2D and 3D they are way sharper, the sharpest screens, and if you are going to spring for this projector try make the image as sharp as it can be and the porthole less nuclear fission like.

[donaldk]

The series 4 Barco's do not have a laser level setting? Some other Baco's have 16-100 setting or even lower.

[Peter CINERAMAX]

Down to 30% the client still finds the highlight zones too  bright, i like at 47 no porthole where it has the most dynamic supersharp image, so with the ND filter we will crank it up.

[donaldk]

Is that lineair to the actual output so 30% of 15000 lumens, so 4500 lumens?

[donaldk]

Down to 30% the client still finds the highlight zones too  bright, i like at 47 no porthole where it has the most dynamic supersharp image, so with the ND filter we will crank it up.
<\q>

Perhaps the Envy can bring something too, with its reported highlights detail recovery and dark area's processing?

[Art Sonneborn]

After trying to get more light from projection for almost all of my adult life this is a good problem to have. Right now I have about 9000 lumens and a 1.3 gain screen so then going to a negative gain screen (which is what I anticipate using) than my thinking was not to use a projector with about the same lumens but instead the next higher output version, of course, the massive contrast jump makes this a point to consider. As you said an ND filter on the port to tweek it could solve the problem.


Art