Barco Thor 4K 6P Residential Laser Projector the best in the World?

[w.mayer]

Since 2002 I have post at AVS Forum about my Projectors I saw own or try in my live and many people around the world know me from there and trust my statements.

As lately are some problems comes up I decide in early December 2016 to stop posting there.

I was not what I want but some circumstances push me to do it.

I was not full happy with this outcome as it was a shame that there was not any more updates published about the development this Projector gets as the Projector I got was a normally Barco DP4K-30L see here:
http://www.barco.com/en/Products/Projectors/Cinema-projectors/Flagship-laser-cinema-projectors/L-series/Ultra-bright-6P-RGB-laser-cinema-projector-for-premium-mid-size-screens.aspx

The Thread at AVS about all this starts at 20 th May 2016 just after some weeks I have visit Barco in there HQ in Belgium and contains a lot of good information and pictures and ends in
early December 2016 where I stop posting in general at AVS.
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/86-ultra-hi-end-ht-gear-20-000/2459858-short-day-barco-6p-4k-laser-dlp.html

So for all that like to read how everything develops I will post here from time to time new information about it and I start later today with 2 exiting  good news!

[w.mayer]

For those that don’t know the full story let me tell you that I order the normally Barco DP 4K-L30 in May 2016 and as this time the High Contrast Version the Thor was not ready
Barco promise to me to upgrade my Unit step by step to the full Thor specification.
After installation Barco Technician was 2 times here to change parts in the Pr. so at the moment this Pr. is a full Thor at least Cr. wise.
The only missing part is the new Alchemy Input section that should be coming in the next weeks.


First the scaling bug was solved.
Problem for me was always that the optic cannot light up the whole 7 meter 2.35 Format screen when the native 3840 pixels are displayed.
I need to scale it to 4096 to fill my screen.
In the past I can do only a horizontally stretch but as the Pr. not do the same stretch vertically the aspect ratio was wrong (too wide).
This I complain since long time and also other Barco DLP Cinema Pr. User from US I know.
But it turns out it was just a matter of the right settings you have to made with the Barco so it was not a Barco bug it was just a missing info about how to adjust it right.

Second I did a big increase about color fidelity.
Color for 2D and 3D BD and all what is Rec. 709 like TV from STB are perfect as it can be but my UHD with DCI Color and HDR never looks perfect.
You must know that I have a very specially way to feed to the HDMI 1.4 Input from the old Alchemy UHD Content in HDR and DCI color.

The Panasonic UHD Player outputs the signal that goes into a Lumagen Pro Scaler than his output goes into a special box and then to the Barco.
This setup is need to do UHD 4K HDR in DCI color with the existing Inputs.

I have always there good colors but they never looks perfect.
Now I found out why.
The Post Software from the Barco allows to put any color coordinates from any color standard inside.
When I do this and put the coordinates from DCI inside the picture looks always a bit to green Yellow.
Not much but you can see it.
I found out that there are 2 different DCI Color specs there!
The coordinates are 100% the same but the white points are different!
See here a picture.
So when I change the white points to D65 bingo now the color looks almost 100% perfect. 
So looks like all UHD Disc are made for the DCI P3 color with D65 and not for the Theater DCI P3 Standard.

Third I put a new 65” 4k OLED from LG at the back right side at the cinema as a Reference Display inside.
As the OLED show today the best possible Picture money can buy I put this LG OLED 2015 Model inside.
I will soon change it to the 2016 Model as this will have much better DCI Colors and it will be the last model with 3D Support as
LG make a in my view very wrong decision to stop 3D Support for their 2017 OLED models to catch up the brightness HDR race with LEDs as the
3D Foil that is necessary drops about 30% light.

Anyway this new OLED are the perfect match to see both images at the same time and allows me things that are impossible to do without having this OLED.

[Nick]

Hi Wolfgang!

Good to see you here  And even better that your fans can now follow your adventures on the DCI-forum
The last information is pretty interesting. I assume that the color reference points (P3 based on D65 point) would be also true for my DP-1200. I will give it a try soon.

Best, Nick

[Cinetom]

The difference in color temperature really makes a difference, very visible. Good post.

[bdgarcia]

Hi Wolfgang - Great to be able to follow your successes again.  My Thor is supposed to ship on 03/03/2017.  My new screen ships on 02/28/2017.  I have started a thread on Avsforum about my build out.  It is titled The Mouse House Theater.

[w.mayer]

Hi Nick nice you join here!

Yes Cinetom its a visible difference even if the first picture include some more adjustments about HDR Gama curve and so on.
Because of this I post this new 2 pictures as they show ONLY the difference between the 2 white points from both DCI P3 Specifications.

Also here in this forum the pictures are much better.
The preview is much bigger for many that just need a small look its may be fine to watch only the
preview and when you go to + you can see the pictures in for sample 4k resolution
with no further compressing!
So a very good picture quality I like it.

[w.mayer]

Hi Bryan

Nice to see you here!

I see your post at AVS but i doubt that this was the right place  .
Think here this page is the perfect place for it and that is the reason why i continue only here.

Hope you will have the same good picture that I have as the Pr. as it was today blow all away that I have seen in my live and I saw a lot  .

[Cinetom]

How is speckle on these.

[w.mayer]

Speckle is depending on Screen you use and other things.

I use a Harkness Matt Preview Screen that is the best non speckling normally Screen and other fabric screens like the V6 are have much less almost not show any speckle at all.

Speckle is also depending on what you see 3D or 2D.
In 2D when you use all 6 Lasers speckle is not a issue for 99.9% when Screen is like the one I have.
In 3D Speckle was more visible as per Eye only 3 Laser works.

I will see if I will may be change my screen to the V6 when my big size will be there and if they can do it perfect without any bugs at all.

[w.mayer]

We watch yesterday the movie "Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children" first in the 3D BD version and later i have check the UHD Disc quality.

First this is a very rare movie in UHD that use the 1.85 Format as most other are using the 2.35 Format.

The picture quality from the 3D BD version was outstanding but also the UHD 2D 4K HDR Rec. 2020 version looks very good.
Some of the early parts of the movie was perfect to show the top Ansi cr. the Barco Laser Pr. have.

It was one more time a good example what a good 3D BD and a good UHD Disc can show at home and this Discs was a perfect tool to show how important a good Ansi Cr. is.

[w.mayer]

I have check again in the movie
"Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children" UHD Disc or 3D BD Version
between 2:50 and 9:00 are some very good parts to see how good ANSI Cr. can look.
This is reference material!

[Cinetom]

Mayer I will give this title a try on my home system "non" Thor projector, I am expecting it will not look as good 

Keep the info coming. I hope Bryan is able to contribute as well.

[w.mayer]

I have many unseen BDs in 3D and 2D.

Now as the Barco was beside that my 4K3D pictures still not work and the new Alchemy Input is missing perfect we see lately a lot of BD movies.
Yesterday I see "Badman The Dark Knight" for the first time on BD.

Like most other BDs we saw after the full cr. upgrade to the Thor Version again this high ANSI Cr. is really specially.

Believe it or not but almost every normally 2D and 3D BD looks a bit like HDR Material!
May some people will say “oh what he tells because the on of cr. is still in the only a bit over 6.000:1 range it can’t be that good” but people that know me for long time know that I not report about it when this is a non-issue or not something very new.

The reason was the high ANSI Cr. in combination with my black box design of my cinema with almost 0 reflection back to the screen I have report since some time.
One week ago we watch with a guest a normally 2D BD and he ask if this was 4K UHD with HDR and Rec. 2020 color.
I say no it was not UHD just a normally 2K BD in 2D but he can’t believe until I show him the disc playing!
So it was not only me that see it this way.

[w.mayer]

I got good news from Barco.

Tim Sinnaeve Residential Managing Director Barco inform me today that I will likely get the new Alchemy
in 2-3 weeks from now.

As our Pay TV Station Sky start to broadcast 4K soccer in 3840x2160 50P I need this new Input to show it.

I can not use my tricks how I can see with the old Alchemy UHD HDR Rec. 2020 4K Disc.
At 4K 50P there is not any trick possible you need the HDMI 2.0 for it.

I now only hope that this unit will offer to see after a 10 month break my 4K 3D slides again or at least not
"much" later.

[w.mayer]

Some months ago I got the OPPO UHD Disc Player but as this was full of different bugs I return it.
Now I got it back as the dealer promise me that most of the bugs I complain ( for sample 24.00P output and not the right 23.976P) are solved.

So it test UHD BD in 2D and 3D and yes I can confirm the running now at the right frame rate with no micro stutter at all.

What was funny to see is how different the OPPO UHD Player output colors compare to the Samsung.
Please see here 2 sample picture where you can compare easy how much different color both Player show.
The Samsung have too much Red that was complained since some time compare to the very natural
looking colors from the new OPPO UHD Player.
Best you can see it in the 20th Century Fox Logo but if you watch close you can see it in the other Picture as well.

I cannot understand how people with a high end Projector can report that they are fine with the Samsung UHD Player!
At one side they talking about Projector calibration like crazy for 1 % more or better color accuracy and on the other side they use a UHD Player that have a far bigger color bug  a Projector can have  and they accept it and run such a UHD Player in there High End system !
I will never understand things like this.
May some of this people should take a close look about my pictures to realize the difference.
Before anybody will ask YES I have the latest Software in the Samsung.

Pictures was taken with the Canon 5DSR a Zeiss Otus 28mm Lens and the
LG 4K 77" OLED and therefore pictures have some kind of interferences visible.